E36 - 3er ab 1990Tanknadel zeigt Tank leer + Reservelampe leuchtet

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shogun
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Beiträge: 2231
Registriert: 05.01.2006, 12:27
Aktuelles Fahrzeug: E32 750iL 11/88
E36 M3
Wohnort: Japan
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Tanknadel zeigt Tank leer + Reservelampe leuchtet

Beitrag von shogun » 01.11.2010, 11:55

Tanknadel zeigt fälschlich leeren Tank an und Reservelampe leuchtet
Die Tankanzeige zeigt einen leeren Tank an, obwohl der Tank nicht leer ist. Ursache für dieses Problem ist in den meisten Fällen ein Kabelbruch am Tankgeber. Lötet man die Leitung wieder fest, verrichtet die Tankanzeige ihren Dienst wieder wie vorgesehen.

ACHTUNG: Folgende Arbeiten nur durchführen, wenn der Tank maximal halbvoll ist, da ansonsten Benzin in den Innenraum auslaufen könnte! Den Geruch bekommt man wochenlang nicht mehr raus!

•Sitzfläche der Rückbank nach oben abziehen (ist nur gesteckt, geht aber evtl. etwas streng.)
•Schallschutz auf der Beifahrerseite zur Seite klappen
•Schrauben des Blechdeckels lösen und den Deckel abnehmen
•Stecker abstecken
•Spritleitungen abklemmen
•große Kunststoffmutter mit Hammer und Meißel oder einem breitem Schraubendreher "aufschlagen", also in Öffnungsrichtung dagegenschlagen.
•Geber inkl. Pumpe herausnehmen und mit Wasser abspülen (sonst könnte es beim Löten ein Feuerchen geben. ;))
•Das lose Kabel (schwer zu übersehen, ist ein sehr starrer Draht) aus seiner Führung ziehen (Fummelarbeit) und wieder anlöten
•Einbau dann natürlich in umgekehrter Reihenfolge

Um die Benzinschläuche wieder festzubekommen empfehlen sich Schlauchschellen. Es reichen angeblich auch ein paar Kabelbinder, die man fest anzieht.


erstellt von CaptainFuture01 aus Motortalk

shogun
Site Admin
Beiträge: 2231
Registriert: 05.01.2006, 12:27
Aktuelles Fahrzeug: E32 750iL 11/88
E36 M3
Wohnort: Japan
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Re: Tanknadel zeigt Tank leer + Reservelampe leuchtet

Beitrag von shogun » 06.09.2011, 16:04

da ich das Problem auch an meinem E36 M3 hatte und beseitigt habe nach weiterer Suche im internet, hier mal ergaenzende Kommentare aus anderen Foren:
Wird sehr wahrscheinlich der Geber direkt sein, sitzt unter der Rücksitzbank links unterm Deckel, würd ihn zuerst mal probeweise, sofern möglich, wechseln, bzw vor dem Wechsel augenscheinlich die Anschlüße und Kabel kontrollieren. Dass das KI defekt ist, würd ich vorerst ausschließen.
Am Tankgeber gibt es ein Kabel das spröde wird und abbricht. Ist eigentlich simpel zu reparieren (neu dran löten), aber du musst dazu die Pumpe auf der Beifahrerseite ausbauen und das machst du am besten mit leerem Tank.
Hab mir mal die 2 Bilder ausgeliehen und runtergeladen (mit Erlaubnis des Fotografen)
http://www.photo-host.org/C8t
http://www.photo-host.org/C88
Bei mir kam das seltsamerweise immer oder meist nach Volltanken, dauerte dann so eine Weile bis es wieder gut war, mal Anzeige gut, dann wieder weg usw, ich nehme an, dass durch die Verwirbelungen im Tank durch das Tanken die losen Kabelverbindungen 'hin- und her geschwappt sind'.

shogun
Site Admin
Beiträge: 2231
Registriert: 05.01.2006, 12:27
Aktuelles Fahrzeug: E32 750iL 11/88
E36 M3
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Re: Tanknadel zeigt Tank leer + Reservelampe leuchtet

Beitrag von shogun » 13.12.2017, 09:16

neues zu dem Thema, habe englische Technische Informationen dazu gefunden:
Fuel gauge stays at empty - fixes
A well known problem on E36, here the fixes copied from another thread: 92 318i Fuel gauge stays at empty
I bought the car not too long ago as a project car. Now my problem currently is that gauge is marking empty all day long. Now it turns on the empty light. I did the instrument panel check and the gauge went up Nd down just fine. I am a automotive tech student at UTI and currently in electrical. I would like to know for any clues/ideas/fixes/recommendations/suggestions to fix this....if not possible way to use another sensor or a aftermarket solution. Any help would be appreciated. Thanks guys...
Sometimes if the car has been refueled with the key in the ignition, the gauge screws up. With ignition on, try pulling fuse 31 under the hood for about 5 seconds ... see if that gets it back to life before you start replacing things.

Same problem here. 98' 328i. Before, my fuel gauge use to flutter up and down and then back to normal, now, it stays @ empty w/ the orange warning light on constantly. Been driving like that for ..... 3/4 of a year now ...
I replaced my fuel level sensor (behind driver seat) and still nothing. I have a feeling that I (and possibly you) may have a wiring issue thats in between both the pumps in the rear under the seat. When my dads' friend who's a mechanic played w/ the wires, the gauge shot up to about 3/4 full-ish.

I think the wiring gets cut/falls off the fuel pump. A fairly common problem with a few guides on the internet.
From what I remember being told a while ago, if the gauge constantly reads half full, then it's the small sender unit on the left that is broken, whereas if the gauge constantly reads empty, then it's the larger sender unit on the right that is broken. As said, this is a common fault, and easier to replace sender unit rather than try to repair, as there is a risk,(so I was told) that any repairs could start a fire in the fuel tank, then it's bye bye car.
Progress is none guys. after messing around with it for a few hrs. I got nothing. Initial inspection showed that the live cable to sensor 2 was sheered clean off. spliced it and made it nice and neat. checked voltage at all sensors and all are with in spec. Now what i did find was a strangler wire. All alone. it wasnt intertwined with all the other cables. so i tried tracing it back but nothing i disappears into the abyss of the car. I will be looking up the intere wiring diagram for the fuel pump 2 dash tomorrow Using AllDATA and see if i make progress in the coming days. I have a temp idea to see if the sensor indeed do work and will be testing it tomorrow

You have two level sensors. If your gauge is working like they described then its most likely the sending unit in either the passenger or drivers side. Certainly do the Fuse 31 test first but I would say all those who posted above are eventually going to find its the sending unit. Find out what the stray wire is by inspecting the fuel pump diagram in the schematic? The wires are all color coded, and they shown where they connect to around the car also. basically what happens is this....the fuel pump/sender and level sender on driver side are wired are wired in series which means that if one leveler is bad then neither will work. So replacing one won't fix the issue. In my case the driver side one is bad because when I checked its resistance was below specs. What I did was on the fuel pump side disconnect the sender and get a 12v battery and send power to the connector going away from the pump and see if the gauge shoots straight to full then get some resistor from radio shack and then test them and see what which resistor gets u a 3/4 tank,1/2 and one quarter....in doing this u check the wiring and you pinpoint the problem at the same time. But I'm pretty sure its the sender on the pump but just like me. The driver side sender is usually fine but since the fuel pump assembly has the sender integrated into it. Its the one that gets most abuse since it is the PRIMARY SENDER and driver side is the SECONDARY. If there is anything else I can do to help anyone then ill try. Hope my experience is helpful

Guys, should the resistance on both senders be the same or not? I have 1/5 of tank (yellow light isn't on) and one resistance on one sender is ~115ohms and on another ~10ohms. Is it wrong or not?
Why did I start to look into this? I've noticed that when going uphill fuel gauge drops noticeably and doesn't rise back. Any ideas?

Old story, but just to give some info here that the search finds a solution in the end. When I filled up my car sometimes the fuel gauge would not show full after I had filled the tank. Red light on = tank empty, then it suddenly jumped back to full while driving, then back to empty. Searched and found: it could be the level sensor which sits inside the lobe of the tank. Remove the back seat and you will see two panels; one on each side. Go to Realoem.com to see arrangement of pump and levels. In my M3 case it looks like this http://www.realoem.com/bmw/showparts.do ... &lang=enUS

also read in another thread: "I'd start with pulling and reinserting fuse #31, just to make sure it's not the classic E36-refueling-with-ignition-on-confuses-the-fuel-gauge-syndrome."
This was not the case on my car. Ignition was off when refuelling and key was even out of ignition, just to comment to above hint.

This happened meanwhile 2 times, weather/climate is warm, so it could not be cold temp causing it. In the end, after some times switching engine on and off within 1 day, it finally worked fine. As if the system is first confused by a fuel refill and needs some time for adjustment. and here the solution I found on an German E36 Forum. Apparently it is unfortunately often that the wire(s) of the fuel gauge sender unit inside the fuel tank get's lose as shown here. Resolder or replace the old wire and the problem should be solved.
Other comments I found:
could be both senders are bad, one on fuel pump and other stand alone, if one works you will get a reading on gauge, if not wire. When I bought my car it had set for over a year and when I turned on key showed no fuel, put in 5 gals and still no reading. I could not get it started and so I replace fuel pump complete with sender and the fuel gauge worked and car started right up. I'm reasonabily sure the sender only on drivers side is probably bad also. I guess it could be the wires.
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I used Contact Cleaner and a course-surfaced business card to clean the contact surface of the sweeper on the fuel level sending units. My symptom set was that the car would display E after a fill up, then after a while it would jump to the then current fuel level and drop normally to E as I consumed fuel, then remain on E after filling the tank. I had to reset the odometer on each fill up to keep track of the gas in the tank. This is the easy way to deal with this problem, by the way -- fill the tank full and reset the trip meter, then drive 300 miles and repeat. I eventually got to the point where the car displayed E for an entire tank of gas, so I took the sending units out and cleaned the sweep contacts. BE VERY CAREFUL TO NOT BEND THE SWEEP CONTACTS. There are a pair of contacts on very thin arms that slide over a pad of fixed contacts. The car sees the contact of the sweep and fixed contact pad and measures the resistance to arrive at the fuel level. It was pretty easy to clean the fuel level sending units. The right side sending unit also houses the fuel pump. If you are willing to fill the tank and reset the odometer, then drive 300 miles and repeat, you can ignore this problem for a very long time.
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Fuel level sender, pump side, has failed open circuit.
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Sounds like the contact pad and sweep are dirty. This can make an open circuit. There isn't very much on the fuel level sending unit to go wrong, and dirty is at the top of the list.
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I removed the fuel pump, covered the opening with a wet tea-towel, let the pump dry, and repaired the broken cable inside. Problem solved.
My 97 328 was doing this. It turned out to be broken wires right at the connector on the sender in the return (non pump) side of the tank. I cut the connector off and soldered on an replacement I had in my junk pile.

http://www.photo-host.org/C8t
http://www.photo-host.org/C88

read the repair manual and it states each sending unit puts out 250 ohms +/- 5 when the tank is full and it AVERAGES the two to get the fuel gauge to show the amount. I checked my left which read 231 and the right, which should 264. I guess they were within range if you average them out (AVG=247.5). OK, note that my tank is full and I didnt want to drive it around till empty. Also, I wouldnt know if I fixed it without a full tank so I worked with a full tank. Make sure to vent the car well and work outside. I twisted off the ring for the right sensor/fuel pump (gas spilled out so make sure you are outside), pulled out the unit, put the O ring back in like it should (it comes out with the unit), then I put the unit back in. I plugged the wiring back and some how the gauge worked like it should. This leads me to believe that the float must have been stuck and by moving the unit around, it came unstuck. So now it works and I'm feeling better.

would a bad fuel sending unit also emit fuel odor after filling up? Every time I fill up, my garage smells like fuel overnight and it is mostly coming from the DRIVER REAR wheel side.

Does this mean my fuel level sensor is bad? If so, as there are two, is it the one with the fuel pump, the one which is behind the passenger seat (right side)? Thanks for any help.
Maybe it IS 3 gallons short.

Do you reset the trip meter and see if you get the full 320 miles, or whatever, out of it before you have to fill up again? Do you put in 16 gallons when it's empty? My experience with a bad fuel level sending unit was that it continued to indicate E even when it war really F. I reset the trip meter, and drive until it gets to 300-ish miles and it shows E. I fill the tank, reset to 000000, and it still shows E. I drive a while and eventually the gauge shows something less than F. I get to 300-ish miles and it shows E again. Fill. Reset, and it still shows E. Repeat. I have to wonder why you would care what Full looks like. Empty is far more critical. I routinely put another gallon or two into my car after the pump clicks off. And each pump clicks off under unique conditions for that particular pump, so if you fill at the same pump and still can fit 3 gallons in, then see if you can fit in more or less at a different pump.

I've got the same problem too. Usually the e36 fuel level problems have to with the gauge just reading "Empty". This is the only thread I found that had to do with the gauge reading just short of "Full", even with a full tank. -I've already replaced the driver's side/sending unit. Problem remains after new unit has been installed. I will remove the passenger side/sending unit + fuel pump combo and see if that solves it.

My gas reading is off, was almost half full (when I know it had 15+ gallons, then after parked overnight it indicated empty, yellow light on. It aso smelled like gas and there was evidence of a little leakage, but not gallons. Then I parked it in the garage and not even a drop of gas, but still a strong smell. I’m thinking It’s not just the gauge because of the smell. I guess I should change the sensors/ pump. . .left and right? Any words of wisdom out there, thanks?

I actually have the exact same issue. I have been smelling fuel for a year only when full, and just today when I filled up it only shows a quarter tank and indicates equal amount of distance until empty. I cannot seem to find anywhere the fuel sending unit on the left side, which I believe it to be... why is this so difficult to find? Anyone?

There are senders on both sides, it's easy to find them- they should have floats attached- follow that trail to the swingy thing. After you've popped the rear seat to reveal the access points- and opened them up- use NEW gaskets to seal the tank and keep vapors out of the car. Past vapor is likely resulting from a faulty gasket.

I've kind of been dealing with this on my project car. I found if you disconnect the battery it resets everything back to normal. Most people run into this issue if then leave the ignition on while they fill the car. My work vehicle is like that. Disconnecting the battery is free. In my case I've been draining the battery on a regular basis as I work through some electrical issues. I know the tank is half full but the gauge eventually drops to almost empty until I disconnect the battery for a minute or 2. If you disconnect the battery make sure you have your radio code if you have a stock BMW radio. You'll need it.
when you say DTE I assume you mean the OBC. Any displays on the OBC will most likely be only an average since the last time it was reset. In the case of the "RANGE" button....that one should automatically reset it self as soon as you add gas to the tank. If your gas gauge isn't reading the correct level to begin with then you wont get the correct RANGE reading.

Here's the solution, we figured this out a while ago:
There's a problem with the newer replacement pumps having the wrong arm/level floater. Also in the thread is a bulletin on two other very common problems.).
BMW Technical Service Bulletin 16 01 92 (3553)
Group 62: Instructions
Bulletin Number: 62 12 91 (3421) Woodcliff Lake, NJ June 1992
Subject: Fuel Gauge Displays Inaccurate Fuel Tank Level
Models: 3 Series (E36)
Situation: Two separate, but related complaints may be encountered:
1.The fuel gauge displays an incorrect level; for example, the gauge appears to stick at approximately 1/2.
2.The fuel gauge does not show maximum level when the tank is filled.
Causes: Two causes may exist for these complaints:

1.Left-hand side fuel level sender (P/N 16 14 1 180 517) sticking (causes gauge to appear to stick at approximately 1/2).
2.Pump nozzle shuts off prematurely when filling fuel tank, creating the incorrect impression that the fuel tank is full, and the fuel gauge does not show the maximum level.

Correction: E36 vehicles produced exhibiting complaint "A" as described above should have an improved left-hand side fuel level sender (P/N 16 14 1 180 517) installed. The improved fuel level sender bears a blue date code stamp of "9.91" or later.
Any vehicle exhibiting complaint "A" should be checked for proper alignment of the fuel level senders (refer to sections 16/12-3 and 16/12-4 of the repair manual).
E36 vehicles exhibiting complaint "B" as described above should have the breather line inspected for restriction and position. Refer to Service Information Bulletin 16 01 92 (3553) for this procedure.
I filled up my tank. Still showed only 60litres instead of 65litres. I then removed my back seat and covers above the fuel level sensors. According to the Bentley service manual the resistance for both sensors should be 250ohms +- 5 ohms when full. Both sensors should also read the same. My results
Left sensor (OEM Brand New) 223ohms
Right sensor (integrated with fuel pump) 250 ohms
The problem is that the left sensor is reading incorrectly. The tank is full as the right sensor is showing full at 250 ohms

I still have my original left sender. I measured the resistance when it was full (all the way up) and empty (all the way down)
My results
Empty 10ohms (Bentley Manual specs 10 ohms +-2ohms)
Full 245ohms (Bentley Manual specs 250 ohms +-5ohms)
This proves that the left sender is reading wrong. My next step would be to remove the sender when the tank is nearly empty and check the resistance manual when its all the way up and all the way down. I also am concerned by that if I keep removing and installing this fuel sender I might break something as its all plastic. My Plan is to measure the resistance when the tank is half full and see if the resistance match the left and right. Then Ill measure it when its near empty

https://www.bimmerforums.com/forum/show ... evel-Issue

Model: BMW E36 (3 series) including BMW 318ti produced from January 1995
Complaint:
Due to the formation of a non-conducting deposit on the conductor surface of the fuel level sensor, the fuel gauge does not read full after re-fuelling, or the fuel gauge is erratic. Remedy:
Remove and replace both fuel level sensors with “Gold system” sensors.
Fuel Gauge Stays Empty after Refuelling/Fuel Gauge Erratic
Model: BMW Z3 Roadster/coupe, BMW M roadster/coupe (E36/7). Vehicles produced before December 15 2000
Complaint:After refuelling the fuel gauge will stay on empty or the fuel gauge is erratic. This is caused by a non-conducting deposit being formed on the conductor surface of the fuel level sensor. For the Z3 from September 1998 and the M roadster/coupe FC 2 (Fuel sensor voltage plausibility) will be set in the Instrument Cluster.
Remedy: Remove and replace the fuel level sensor with a ‘Gold system’ sensor referring to repair instructions 16 12 000.
Model:
BMW Z3 (E36/7) produced from September 1998 to April 1999
Complaint:
After refuelling the fuel gauge reads ¼ full, and will then move extremely slowly to read full. This is due to a software error in the Instrument Cluster.
Remedy: Re-code the instrument cluster using DIS CD Version 18.0 or later:
-Select Coding/Programming/ZCS Coding/E36/Recoding/Kombi and then follow the on-screen instructions to complete the coding process.
-Recoding the instrument cluster will start an internal day counter. If the test3.1 contains a value greater than 0 indicates the instrument cluster will already contain the fix.

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